WEBVTT

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<v ->Well hi everyone.</v>

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Thank you for joining us today for our webinar

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"Heroism and Heartache."

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We welcome John Pentangelo who will be sharing

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with us about USS Cumberland's last stand at Hampton Roads.

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I'm Shannon Ricles.

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I'm Shannon Ricles, the Education

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and Outreach coordinator for Monitor

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and Mallows Bay National Marine Sanctuaries.

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And I'm going be one of your hosts today.

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<v ->And I am Jessie Frayser,</v>

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the Education and Outreach support specialist,

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also with Monitor and Mallows Bay.

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And I'll be your co-host.

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<v ->All right.</v>

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This webinar is brought to you

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by NOAA's Monitor National Marine Sanctuary,

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in collaboration with the North Carolina Office

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of State Archeology.

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<v ->Partnering since 1975.</v>

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NOAA and the state of North Carolina work to research,

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honor and protect the hallmark

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of North Carolina's underwater cultural heritage,

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shipwrecks.

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These shipwrecks hold information about the ever-changing

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technologies and cultural and physical landscapes.

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They serve as a uniquely accessible underwater museums

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and a memorial to generations of mariners who lived, died,

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worked and fought off our shores.

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This is one of the many webinars we will be hosting

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in the coming months

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of the Submerged North Carolina Webinar Series

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in collaboration with the North Carolina Office

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of State Archeology.

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<v ->Monitor is just one</v>

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of 15 National Marine Sanctuaries

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and two Marine National Monuments

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in the National Marine Sanctuary System.

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Now this system encompasses more than 620,000 square miles

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of marine and Great Lakes water from Washington State

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to the Florida Keys and from Lake Huron to American Samoa.

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Now during the presentation,

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all attendees will be in listen only mode.

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You are welcome to type questions

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for the presenter into the question box at the bottom

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of the control panel on the righthand side of your screen.

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This is the same area you can let us know

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about any technical issues you may be having

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that we can help you with

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and we'll be monitoring the incoming questions and issues

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and we'll respond to them just as soon as we can.

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We are recording this session

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and we will share the recording

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with registered participants via the webinar archive page

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and a URL for the webpage will be

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provided at the end of this presentation

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and also in a follow-up email.

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<v ->So now we're excited to turn it over to John Pentangelo,</v>

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the director of the Hampton Roads Naval Museum.

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<v ->Well thank you Jessica and Shannon.</v>

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Thank you for the introduction

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and I also just real quick thank you

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for inviting me to speak.

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It is absolutely always a pleasure to work with NOOA.

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Before I begin, I'm gonna share my screen with you right now

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and

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get you going.

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Okay.

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Before I begin,

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I just wanna say a few words about the museum.

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We're located in Nauticus, downtown Norfolk,

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next to the Battleship Wisconsin.

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And we're one of 10 official

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Department of the Navy museums

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administered by the Naval History

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and Heritage Command in Washington DC.

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And we interpret the naval history of Hampton Roads,

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which is extensive as you can imagine,

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dating from the oldest Navy shipyard in the nation,

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which actually predates the founding of our country,

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through to the present day as home

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of the largest naval complex in the world,

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Naval Station Norfolk.

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In a larger sense, we use this history to

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teach sailors today

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and to help the American people better understand

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and appreciate their Navy.

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And I'll just say real quick

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that this presentation is my opinion

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and not the opinion of the United States Navy.

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It's very important that I always say that.

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So I'm gonna talk to you today about the USS Cumberland

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and I'm gonna talk to you in the context of one battle

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during the American Civil War.

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Why am I gonna talk just about the Cumberland?

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Well, let me just flip back at this.

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Well, one of the most significant parts

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of Hampton Roads naval history is the battle

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that occurred here between March 8th and March 9th, 1862.

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It's a battle that's not only famous in Civil War history,

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but in world history for the events

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that occurred on the second day.

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And of course, I'm referring to the first battle

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between ironclad warships,

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the Confederate ironclad CSS Virginia

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and the revolutionary Union turreted ironclad USS Monitor.

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And this event has always been a strong part

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of the museum's interpretation.

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In fact, the museum had a replica turret of the Monitor

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as part of its exhibit since the 1980s.

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I think before NOOA raised the turret,

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certainly before the Monitor Center was built

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at The Mariners Museum in Newport News.

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Now the clash of these two vessels on March 9th

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in Hampton Roads has been studied

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and remembered both at home

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and abroad for over 160 years.

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You know, but in concentrating on the events

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of March 9th, 1862, we've relegated the events of the day

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before to kind of a footnote or perhaps a prologue

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or the first act of a drama.

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At worst, we've forgotten the events altogether.

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By the end of the day though, on March 8th, the first day,

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the ironclad rammed CSS Virginia had destroyed two great

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vessels of the North Atlantic blockading squadron

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and killed over 250,

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including 123 sailors on the USS Cumberland.

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March 8th was the bloodiest day in the history

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of the United States Navy up until that time

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and arguably the worst defeat in naval history

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until Pearl Harbor.

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And think on that for a minute.

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Pearl Harbor, the USS Arizona, over a thousand sailors

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and Marines killed aboard.

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Imagine for a moment that a seminal naval battle

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occurred like Midway or the Coral Sea,

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right about the next day

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in and around Pearl Harbor.

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If that did happen, some revolutionary naval battle,

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would we have forgotten about the sailors

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and marines who died aboard Arizona?

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Would we have relegated their story to a footnote?

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Of course, we hope not.

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So we strive to tell the story of USS Cumberland

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and her crews' sacrifice so that they are not forgotten.

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And additionally, Hampton Roads Naval Museum is considered

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the official repository

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for any artifacts recovered from the wrecks

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of the Cumberland and the CSS Florida

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and Florida sank in the James River nearby Cumberland.

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And these 450 artifacts tell a dramatic story

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of the Civil War as it occurred at sea.

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And coming out of the pandemic, we decided

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to update our exhibit on the Battle of Hampton Roads

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to refocus more attention on Cumberland

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and display more of the artifact collection,

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much of which had never been on exhibit.

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The exhibit was completed last year

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and I hope you'll all come and see it soon.

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Please check our website in the coming weeks

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for a virtual tour, which we'll be uploading.

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All right, at long last, let's dive in

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and talk about this warship.

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Let's talk about how it got to Hampton Roads in 1862.

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Its great sacrifice on March 8th

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and what happened to it in the decades

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after the battle.

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Named for the Cumberland, excuse me, Cumberland River,

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which flows west across Kentucky

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and Tennessee into the Ohio River,

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the Navy launched the frigate USS Cumberland

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at the Charlestown Navy Yard on May 24th, 1842.

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Naval architect William Dowdy,

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he based the ship's design on the kind

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of classic American frigate design, think USS Constitution.

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And for our purposes, a frigate is a ship,

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and a ship is a three masted wooden

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sailing vessel, square rigged,

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square being the relative shape of the sails

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as you see there in the image.

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And a frigate is a type of warship that has a battery

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of guns, a broadside battery of guns on two decks,

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it's gun deck and above it on a spar deck

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or a weather deck, as you call it.

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Cumberland's keel was actually laid in 1825

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as part of a long-term program called

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the Act for the Gradual Increase of the Navy,

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but was not launched until 1842

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due to numerous delays caused by design alterations

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and insufficient budget appropriations.

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Not much has changed.

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The frigate was 175 feet long with a 21 foot draft

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and was ultimately armed with 54 guns, a combination

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of 32 pound long guns and 42 pound carronades

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and those fired solid shot.

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Additionally, right when she was commissioned, she was armed

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with the latest of four of the latest eight-inch shell guns

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and the crew numbered about 400 men.

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This is one of my favorite images of the USS Cumberland,

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and I'll talk about it in one second.

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Cumberland had a long career

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before that fateful day in 1862

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during the Mexican-American War in 1848.

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The ship supported a naval blockade, it battled boredom

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and yellow fever, but also it joined in several armed

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expeditions against some

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of the smaller Mexican towns.

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Cumberland's captain at the time, French Forrest,

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he led a contingent of sailors

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and marines against the city of Tabasco.

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And the attack succeeded,

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but it claimed the life of one of the ship's lieutenants.

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Incidentally Forrest will go on to join the Confederate Navy

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and in that capacity, he will become commandant

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of the Gosport Navy yard when the Confederacy raises

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the USS Merrimack and tows her into dry dock

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and converts her into the ironclad Virginia.

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So that's just a little interesting fact there.

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The image you see here is

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of Cumberland hosting a ball in Spezia.

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Now during Cumberland's construction

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and service history, the Navy dealt with a host of issues.

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It dealt with piracy.

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It sent an exploring expedition to circumnavigate the globe.

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It established commercial ties with the isolationist Japan

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and even established an African squadron,

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which I'll talk about in a minute.

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But much of what the Navy did was showing the flag

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for diplomatic purposes.

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And nowhere was this more evident than in the Mediterranean.

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Cumberland served in the Mediterranean three times,

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and as the image demonstrates, both naval officers

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and local leaders of port cities were very fond

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of hosting dinners, balls,

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and other social occasions while the sailors enjoyed

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shore leave a bit more

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than they might have in other locales.

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Indeed one officer referred to this duty

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as a perpetual yachting party.

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Now in 1857, while in the Charlestown Navy yard,

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the Navy converted the frigate into a 24-gun sloop of war.

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Essentially, what they call raisine,

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they converted it into a single deck gun platform

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by lowering the top deck there

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and faster and lighter sloops, they didn't have to carry

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as many guns, and firing shell guns,

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which were the latest rage in the Navy, which fired these

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rather than solid shot, exploding shells

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that could do much more damage.

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Ships could be smaller and faster and lighter now

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because they needed fewer guns

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and they also needed fewer crews to operate them.

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So Cumberland's complement of guns goes down to 24

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and she's armed with nine-inch Dahlgren shell guns.

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And the crew goes from about 400 to about 300, 350.

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00:11:54.360 --> 00:11:57.120
Newly recommissioned Cumberland sailed to West Africa

257
00:11:57.120 --> 00:11:59.310
as the flagship of the African squadron,

258
00:11:59.310 --> 00:12:01.350
which at the time is a fleet of four vessels

259
00:12:01.350 --> 00:12:03.360
that patrolled the coast of West Africa

260
00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:05.340
to protect legal American commerce

261
00:12:05.340 --> 00:12:07.470
and suppress the transatlantic slave trade,

262
00:12:07.470 --> 00:12:09.063
which was illegal at the time.

263
00:12:10.050 --> 00:12:13.020
Now, during the cruise, Cumberland only seized one slaver.

264
00:12:13.020 --> 00:12:15.900
They doubted that the courts would uphold their decision.

265
00:12:15.900 --> 00:12:18.150
So they ultimately released the ship.

266
00:12:18.150 --> 00:12:19.500
And that was not uncommon.

267
00:12:19.500 --> 00:12:21.790
Both the government and the Navy prioritized

268
00:12:23.070 --> 00:12:26.250
the protection of legal commerce over trying

269
00:12:26.250 --> 00:12:28.260
to catch sailors.

270
00:12:28.260 --> 00:12:31.140
And it was very hard, difficult for them to prosecute them.

271
00:12:31.140 --> 00:12:33.060
So that's not at all uncommon.

272
00:12:33.060 --> 00:12:36.240
After her tour in Africa, which was not exactly

273
00:12:36.240 --> 00:12:39.660
what you would call a success, Cumberland returned

274
00:12:39.660 --> 00:12:42.090
to the United States in September, 1859

275
00:12:42.090 --> 00:12:44.100
to serve in the home squadron.

276
00:12:44.100 --> 00:12:48.720
And interestingly, this secession crisis is erupting

277
00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:51.030
and Cumberland will be one of the few ships capable

278
00:12:51.030 --> 00:12:53.913
of defending US property when that happens.

279
00:12:56.970 --> 00:13:00.420
So we all know that most Civil War historians concentrate

280
00:13:00.420 --> 00:13:03.360
on the land war, but there was certainly a very active

281
00:13:03.360 --> 00:13:04.590
navy side to it.

282
00:13:04.590 --> 00:13:06.600
And when it comes to the naval side of things,

283
00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:08.940
the Confederacy was never going

284
00:13:08.940 --> 00:13:11.430
to match the United States Navy ship for ship.

285
00:13:11.430 --> 00:13:15.600
It had neither the infrastructure, the industrial capacity,

286
00:13:15.600 --> 00:13:17.703
the money, or the manpower to do that.

287
00:13:19.740 --> 00:13:23.430
When the war starts, the Navy has 90 ships on its roles

288
00:13:23.430 --> 00:13:27.090
and about 42 or inactive service

289
00:13:27.090 --> 00:13:28.113
or ready to fight.

290
00:13:29.760 --> 00:13:30.840
By the war's end, though,

291
00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:34.020
the Union Navy numbers over 600 vessels,

292
00:13:34.020 --> 00:13:37.140
the Confederacy can never match that kind of production.

293
00:13:37.140 --> 00:13:38.460
The main contribution

294
00:13:38.460 --> 00:13:42.600
of all these naval vessels is the blockade of 3000 miles

295
00:13:42.600 --> 00:13:43.740
of Southern coastline.

296
00:13:43.740 --> 00:13:47.520
As you see in the map here, it's a critical component

297
00:13:47.520 --> 00:13:49.230
of the Northern strategy.

298
00:13:49.230 --> 00:13:52.230
And the South's response is going to be

299
00:13:52.230 --> 00:13:55.560
to employ commerce raiders on the high seas

300
00:13:55.560 --> 00:13:58.800
to attack merchant ship men.

301
00:13:58.800 --> 00:14:02.040
They're gonna utilize fortifications rather than build a big

302
00:14:02.040 --> 00:14:04.770
navy or small gunboat navy, they're going

303
00:14:04.770 --> 00:14:06.780
to utilize coastal fortifications

304
00:14:06.780 --> 00:14:09.270
to protect the ports and rivers.

305
00:14:09.270 --> 00:14:12.330
They're also gonna embark on an ambitious program

306
00:14:12.330 --> 00:14:15.270
of building ironclad warships with their vision being

307
00:14:15.270 --> 00:14:19.110
that one of these ships will be able to destroy

308
00:14:19.110 --> 00:14:22.200
any wooden Union ship that it comes across.

309
00:14:22.200 --> 00:14:25.830
So put a lot of money into relatively few amount of ships,

310
00:14:25.830 --> 00:14:27.573
which will pack a very big punch.

311
00:14:30.090 --> 00:14:34.620
On April 21st, 1861, fear of a Confederate attack

312
00:14:34.620 --> 00:14:37.440
on the Gosport Navy Yard in Portsmouth, Virginia,

313
00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:41.130
now known as the Norfolk Naval Shipyard, led the US Navy

314
00:14:41.130 --> 00:14:43.500
to abandon this critical possession.

315
00:14:43.500 --> 00:14:46.140
And several ships, including the steam powered screw frigate

316
00:14:46.140 --> 00:14:48.660
USS Merrimack were burned and scuttled.

317
00:14:48.660 --> 00:14:50.970
The occupants destroyed much of the infrastructure,

318
00:14:50.970 --> 00:14:55.320
but not more than 1000 large caliber naval guns

319
00:14:55.320 --> 00:14:56.520
that are on the yard.

320
00:14:56.520 --> 00:14:58.533
Some of the estimates say up to 3000.

321
00:14:59.610 --> 00:15:02.310
And these same guns, which they failed to destroy,

322
00:15:02.310 --> 00:15:04.710
are captured by the Confederacy

323
00:15:04.710 --> 00:15:07.260
and they end up firing on Union warships

324
00:15:07.260 --> 00:15:10.380
and coastal fortifications throughout the South.

325
00:15:10.380 --> 00:15:13.620
One ship though that did escape this destruction

326
00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:15.903
was the sloop of war USS Cumberland.

327
00:15:18.210 --> 00:15:20.360
Several months later, Cumberland joined other vessels

328
00:15:20.360 --> 00:15:22.260
of the North Atlantic blockading squadron

329
00:15:22.260 --> 00:15:23.730
to overtake Forts Clark

330
00:15:23.730 --> 00:15:26.400
and Hatteras at Hatteras Inlet, North Carolina.

331
00:15:26.400 --> 00:15:27.990
And this is interesting

332
00:15:27.990 --> 00:15:30.600
'cause it's the first combined operation working

333
00:15:30.600 --> 00:15:31.860
with the Army, the first combined

334
00:15:31.860 --> 00:15:33.750
operation of the Civil War.

335
00:15:33.750 --> 00:15:36.660
And after this action, Cumberland returns to Hampton Roads

336
00:15:36.660 --> 00:15:39.273
to enforce the blockade of the Chesapeake Bay.

337
00:15:41.790 --> 00:15:44.640
And why was the Navy in Hampton Roads to begin with?

338
00:15:44.640 --> 00:15:46.860
Well, the Union and the Confederacy both understood

339
00:15:46.860 --> 00:15:49.210
the strategic importance of this body of water.

340
00:15:50.160 --> 00:15:52.710
It's a large natural harbor

341
00:15:52.710 --> 00:15:56.730
and a warm water port that will become even more contentious

342
00:15:56.730 --> 00:16:01.470
as the Confederate capital city of Richmond takes shape

343
00:16:01.470 --> 00:16:06.470
and the roads give the capital city of Richmond access

344
00:16:07.500 --> 00:16:09.870
to international markets via the James River.

345
00:16:09.870 --> 00:16:12.300
So you can't really see Richmond on the map there,

346
00:16:12.300 --> 00:16:15.363
but it's up the James a ways.

347
00:16:17.070 --> 00:16:19.710
So the United States Navy needed the harbor as a base

348
00:16:19.710 --> 00:16:22.620
for the North Atlantic Blockading Squadron

349
00:16:22.620 --> 00:16:26.370
and as an access point to invade the Virginia Tidewater.

350
00:16:26.370 --> 00:16:29.400
To control Hampton Roads, the Navy deployed five warships,

351
00:16:29.400 --> 00:16:30.600
including Cumberland,

352
00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:33.750
also the frigates, Minnesota and Congress

353
00:16:33.750 --> 00:16:36.420
and St. Lawrence and the Roanoke,

354
00:16:36.420 --> 00:16:38.973
and a number of smaller vessels as well.

355
00:16:39.930 --> 00:16:41.370
To break the Yankee blockade,

356
00:16:41.370 --> 00:16:43.800
the Confederacy raised USS Merrimack

357
00:16:43.800 --> 00:16:46.350
and used Gosport Navy Yard stone dry dock

358
00:16:46.350 --> 00:16:49.290
to build the armored case mate on its hull,

359
00:16:49.290 --> 00:16:50.670
fitted with an iron ram

360
00:16:50.670 --> 00:16:54.480
and armed with four inches of iron over two feet of wood.

361
00:16:54.480 --> 00:16:58.440
The newly named CSS Virginia was destined for a showdown

362
00:16:58.440 --> 00:17:01.020
with a blockading squadron in an attempt

363
00:17:01.020 --> 00:17:04.290
to break the Union's control over this vital waterway.

364
00:17:04.290 --> 00:17:08.220
Now you know why the Virginia was so necessary

365
00:17:08.220 --> 00:17:11.313
for the Confederacy and how dangerous it was.

366
00:17:16.980 --> 00:17:20.310
Now as the sun rose on March 8th, 1862,

367
00:17:20.310 --> 00:17:21.630
everyone in Hampton Roads

368
00:17:21.630 --> 00:17:25.540
and most in Washington DC for that matter, I guess knew

369
00:17:26.527 --> 00:17:30.270
the CSS Virginia was coming soon, perhaps not the exact day,

370
00:17:30.270 --> 00:17:33.210
but it was being built and it was in the papers.

371
00:17:33.210 --> 00:17:36.390
Now finished just the day before on March 7th,

372
00:17:36.390 --> 00:17:39.780
Flag Officer Franklin Buchanan orders Virginia out

373
00:17:39.780 --> 00:17:41.490
on a trial cruise.

374
00:17:41.490 --> 00:17:43.410
At least that's what he tells people.

375
00:17:43.410 --> 00:17:45.780
But what he really intends to do

376
00:17:45.780 --> 00:17:48.183
is attack the blockading squadron.

377
00:17:49.290 --> 00:17:51.030
It's a beautiful clear spring day.

378
00:17:51.030 --> 00:17:53.610
It's a Saturday, it's laundry day.

379
00:17:53.610 --> 00:17:57.900
So from the yard arms of the vessels in the squadron,

380
00:17:57.900 --> 00:18:01.830
there's laundry hanging from them to dry.

381
00:18:01.830 --> 00:18:04.420
'Cause the next day Sunday will be the muster

382
00:18:05.670 --> 00:18:08.160
and everyone has to look their best

383
00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:10.830
and Cumberland's Captain Commander William Radford

384
00:18:10.830 --> 00:18:12.450
will be aboard another ship that day.

385
00:18:12.450 --> 00:18:13.950
He's attending a court martial

386
00:18:13.950 --> 00:18:17.373
and executive officer George Morris was left in command.

387
00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:22.440
At 12:30 PM, one sailor caught sight

388
00:18:22.440 --> 00:18:25.860
of the CSS Virginia steaming north on the Elizabeth River.

389
00:18:25.860 --> 00:18:27.540
Now in the bottom of the map there,

390
00:18:27.540 --> 00:18:29.550
provided by the American Battlefield Trust,

391
00:18:29.550 --> 00:18:33.060
that red line coming from the the south

392
00:18:33.060 --> 00:18:35.160
is the CSS Virginia.

393
00:18:35.160 --> 00:18:36.510
And you're gonna see it turns

394
00:18:36.510 --> 00:18:39.303
and goes west towards the James River.

395
00:18:40.800 --> 00:18:44.460
So at Newport News Pointe,

396
00:18:44.460 --> 00:18:49.460
up where it says Camp Butler there on the map

397
00:18:49.920 --> 00:18:54.920
that's to the west is USS Cumberland.

398
00:18:55.260 --> 00:18:57.300
And so at 12:30,

399
00:18:57.300 --> 00:19:00.750
sailors from the Cumberland will spot Virginia,

400
00:19:00.750 --> 00:19:04.050
spot the smoke coming out of the stack, coming out

401
00:19:04.050 --> 00:19:08.730
of the Elizabeth River and steaming north.

402
00:19:08.730 --> 00:19:12.390
And the ship isn't very fast, it's going about five knots.

403
00:19:12.390 --> 00:19:14.493
It takes more than an hour to get across.

404
00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:20.100
As one sailor recalled, "Every eye on the vessel was on her,

405
00:19:20.100 --> 00:19:21.510
not a word was spoken.

406
00:19:21.510 --> 00:19:24.360
And the silence that prevailed was awful.

407
00:19:24.360 --> 00:19:28.050
The time seemed hours before she reached us."

408
00:19:28.050 --> 00:19:31.980
An imposing ironclad CSS Virginia boasted a 1500-pound

409
00:19:31.980 --> 00:19:34.650
iron ram on the front of the ship.

410
00:19:34.650 --> 00:19:36.630
Flag Officer Buchanan declared

411
00:19:36.630 --> 00:19:40.590
to his crew, "I am going to ram the Cumberland.

412
00:19:40.590 --> 00:19:43.230
I'm told she has the new rifle guns,

413
00:19:43.230 --> 00:19:47.580
the only ones in their whole fleet we have cause to fear."

414
00:19:47.580 --> 00:19:52.580
We think he means a pivot gun on the aft end of Cumberland,

415
00:19:52.770 --> 00:19:56.340
which is listed as a 70-pound rifle,

416
00:19:56.340 --> 00:19:58.740
but there are no 70-pound rifles in the inventory.

417
00:19:58.740 --> 00:20:02.493
So it's probably a 60- or an 80-pound rifle gun.

418
00:20:04.110 --> 00:20:07.563
And it's only one, but he fears that they have more of them.

419
00:20:08.585 --> 00:20:10.980
As Virginia appeared in the Roads,

420
00:20:10.980 --> 00:20:13.380
Cumberland sailors raced into their battle stations

421
00:20:13.380 --> 00:20:17.190
and prepared to face this curious foe.

422
00:20:17.190 --> 00:20:20.250
At 2:00 PM, about an hour and a half later,

423
00:20:20.250 --> 00:20:22.050
Virginia begins to trade shots

424
00:20:22.050 --> 00:20:25.200
with the USS Congress, which is nearby as it passed by

425
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.990
and continues to steam for the Cumberland.

426
00:20:27.990 --> 00:20:29.730
It had already begun firing

427
00:20:29.730 --> 00:20:33.600
as it headed towards this sloop of war.

428
00:20:33.600 --> 00:20:38.460
Virginia's first shot from a rifled gun at her bow will

429
00:20:38.460 --> 00:20:42.180
kill or wound nine of Cumberland's Marines.

430
00:20:42.180 --> 00:20:45.390
So they're all at one gun, so it's a very accurate shot.

431
00:20:45.390 --> 00:20:48.120
Private Daniel O'Connor remembers,"Yyou could not step

432
00:20:48.120 --> 00:20:51.300
on the quarter deck without walking through the blood."

433
00:20:51.300 --> 00:20:53.610
While Cumberland's crew skillfully returned fire,

434
00:20:53.610 --> 00:20:56.970
their shots bounced right off of Virginia's armor.

435
00:20:56.970 --> 00:21:00.030
The second shot from Virginia's seven-inch brook rifle

436
00:21:00.030 --> 00:21:03.750
killed an entire gun crew except the powder boy.

437
00:21:03.750 --> 00:21:05.733
And this is on the weather deck.

438
00:21:08.250 --> 00:21:10.740
Aboard Cumberland, Lieutenant Thomas Selfridge remembered

439
00:21:10.740 --> 00:21:12.480
how the warships crew held firm.

440
00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:14.430
No one flinched, he said.

441
00:21:14.430 --> 00:21:16.410
But everyone went on rapidly loading

442
00:21:16.410 --> 00:21:18.570
and firing, the places of the killed

443
00:21:18.570 --> 00:21:20.880
and wounded being taken promptly by others.

444
00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:22.473
The carnage was frightful.

445
00:21:25.050 --> 00:21:27.900
Then at 3:05 PM, Virginia used its iron ram

446
00:21:27.900 --> 00:21:29.820
to smash into the wooden Cumberland,

447
00:21:29.820 --> 00:21:32.820
tearing a massive hole in the starboard bow

448
00:21:32.820 --> 00:21:36.570
that one eyewitness will say was big enough to drive a horse

449
00:21:36.570 --> 00:21:37.653
and cart through.

450
00:21:38.670 --> 00:21:40.860
The ram became stuck, threatening

451
00:21:40.860 --> 00:21:42.540
to sink both ships.

452
00:21:42.540 --> 00:21:45.090
Lieutenant John Taylor Wood on Virginia had served on

453
00:21:45.090 --> 00:21:46.470
Cumberland as a midshipman

454
00:21:46.470 --> 00:21:49.200
and he will say that this action demonstrated

455
00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:50.820
for the first time the power

456
00:21:50.820 --> 00:21:54.090
and efficiency of the ram as a means of offense.

457
00:21:54.090 --> 00:21:57.783
The side of Cumberland was crushed like an eggshell.

458
00:21:58.830 --> 00:22:00.750
Mortally wounded, the ship refused

459
00:22:00.750 --> 00:22:02.160
to go down without a fight.

460
00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:06.480
Cumberland's gun crew fired three broadside at Virginia

461
00:22:06.480 --> 00:22:08.576
devastating broadsides.

462
00:22:08.576 --> 00:22:10.260
They blew the muzzles off of two

463
00:22:10.260 --> 00:22:12.930
of Virginia's nine-inch Dahlgren guns.

464
00:22:12.930 --> 00:22:15.000
The attack killed two of Virginia's sailors

465
00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:16.533
and wounded several more.

466
00:22:17.670 --> 00:22:19.590
Virginia's armor held during the attack,

467
00:22:19.590 --> 00:22:22.740
but the ironclad did not retire undamaged,

468
00:22:22.740 --> 00:22:25.443
the ram was stuck inside Cumberland's hull,

469
00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:30.480
Virginia's executive officer, Lieutenant Catesby Jones,

470
00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:33.240
remembered quote, "For a moment

471
00:22:33.240 --> 00:22:35.220
the whole weight of her hung on our prowl

472
00:22:35.220 --> 00:22:38.100
and threatened to carry us down with her.

473
00:22:38.100 --> 00:22:42.000
Then the ram, having luckily been for Virginia,

474
00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:46.020
been improperly secured, snapped off, allowing Virginia

475
00:22:46.020 --> 00:22:49.560
to avoid a watery grave while losing its best weapon."

476
00:22:49.560 --> 00:22:53.580
Lieutenant Jones explained We had left our cast iron beak in

477
00:22:53.580 --> 00:22:56.460
the side of Cumberland and like the wasp we could sting

478
00:22:56.460 --> 00:22:59.553
but once, leaving the sting in the wound."

479
00:23:00.600 --> 00:23:01.980
As the sloop of war sank,

480
00:23:01.980 --> 00:23:05.220
an officer on CSS Virginia implored Cumberland's crew

481
00:23:05.220 --> 00:23:06.660
to surrender.

482
00:23:06.660 --> 00:23:08.550
Cumberland's acting commanding officer

483
00:23:08.550 --> 00:23:11.763
Lieutenant George Morris replied in no uncertain terms,

484
00:23:12.750 --> 00:23:14.940
"Damn you, you coward.

485
00:23:14.940 --> 00:23:17.430
You have made a slaughterhouse of our ship.

486
00:23:17.430 --> 00:23:20.400
We will sink with our colors flying."

487
00:23:20.400 --> 00:23:22.683
And that is exactly what they did.

488
00:23:23.520 --> 00:23:26.430
At 3:15 PM, Cumberland sailors unable to help

489
00:23:26.430 --> 00:23:29.850
many of their wounded comrades began to abandon ship.

490
00:23:29.850 --> 00:23:32.040
Lieutenant Thomas Selfridge remembered,

491
00:23:32.040 --> 00:23:35.460
"The water was rising rapidly, the Cumberland going down

492
00:23:35.460 --> 00:23:38.580
by the bows, as the water gained the birth deck,

493
00:23:38.580 --> 00:23:41.730
which by this time was filled with the badly wounded

494
00:23:41.730 --> 00:23:43.380
heartrending cries above the din

495
00:23:43.380 --> 00:23:46.200
of combat could be heard from the fellows

496
00:23:46.200 --> 00:23:48.090
as they realized their helplessness

497
00:23:48.090 --> 00:23:50.583
to escape slow death from drowning.

498
00:23:52.560 --> 00:23:54.570
Despite the enormous hole in Cumberland's bow,

499
00:23:54.570 --> 00:23:57.120
the sinking did occur slowly.

500
00:23:57.120 --> 00:23:59.697
By 3:35 PM water reached the main hatchway

501
00:23:59.697 --> 00:24:02.700
and the ship began to list to starboard.

502
00:24:02.700 --> 00:24:05.130
Sailors on the main deck leaped into the water

503
00:24:05.130 --> 00:24:08.670
and tried to swim while others jumped from the gunports.

504
00:24:08.670 --> 00:24:12.090
Many others took refuge in the rigging, working frantically,

505
00:24:12.090 --> 00:24:15.570
the crew lashed many of the wounded to racks and mess chests

506
00:24:15.570 --> 00:24:16.713
and set them adrift."

507
00:24:18.780 --> 00:24:20.940
A soldier in the 20th Indiana Infantry

508
00:24:20.940 --> 00:24:24.480
who was stationed in Newport News, looking on remembered,

509
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:28.050
"I soon saw the unequal contest was about ended

510
00:24:28.050 --> 00:24:30.180
for the Cumberland was fast sinking.

511
00:24:30.180 --> 00:24:32.400
Men were jumping into the river to try

512
00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:34.770
to swim ashore, which many did.

513
00:24:34.770 --> 00:24:37.653
Yet many were carried down with the vessel.

514
00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:40.890
Other Union warships deployed small boats

515
00:24:40.890 --> 00:24:42.150
to rescue the survivors.

516
00:24:42.150 --> 00:24:43.260
While Union Soldiers

517
00:24:43.260 --> 00:24:45.960
and Newport News Point entered the waters to help.

518
00:24:45.960 --> 00:24:47.460
Not all were saved."

519
00:24:47.460 --> 00:24:52.460
Out of a crew of 376 sailors, 123 were lost.

520
00:24:54.360 --> 00:24:56.940
Now everything you read about Cumberland

521
00:24:56.940 --> 00:25:00.060
from the earliest days in 1862 up until the present day

522
00:25:00.060 --> 00:25:03.870
is gonna say 121 sailors were lost.

523
00:25:03.870 --> 00:25:05.883
We believe this number to be incorrect.

524
00:25:07.050 --> 00:25:09.990
A closer look at some of the muster rolls

525
00:25:09.990 --> 00:25:11.550
or the list of survivors

526
00:25:11.550 --> 00:25:13.410
where the figure comes from indicates

527
00:25:13.410 --> 00:25:15.630
that two people are left off.

528
00:25:15.630 --> 00:25:19.173
Survivors are on the survivors list that should not be.

529
00:25:20.070 --> 00:25:21.390
Chaplain John Lenhardt

530
00:25:21.390 --> 00:25:23.163
and Masters Mate John Harrington.

531
00:25:24.561 --> 00:25:29.040
The the list that's created doesn't account for their death.

532
00:25:29.040 --> 00:25:30.750
So the number is 123.

533
00:25:30.750 --> 00:25:32.673
In case somebody wants to correct me.

534
00:25:33.840 --> 00:25:36.570
Now, thousands of eyes watch the sloop of war perish.

535
00:25:36.570 --> 00:25:38.760
Soldiers and civilians are lining the shore

536
00:25:38.760 --> 00:25:41.430
and nearby Union sailors on other warships

537
00:25:41.430 --> 00:25:42.963
are looking on in horror.

538
00:25:43.950 --> 00:25:46.080
Most Northern observers reported the sinking

539
00:25:46.080 --> 00:25:47.190
with both sadness

540
00:25:47.190 --> 00:25:50.763
but also pride that Cumberland sailors did not surrender.

541
00:25:51.780 --> 00:25:55.410
Commander Radford later stated, "I had the satisfaction

542
00:25:55.410 --> 00:25:57.330
of reporting that Cumberland fought as long

543
00:25:57.330 --> 00:25:59.220
as her guns were above water."

544
00:25:59.220 --> 00:26:02.700
Acting commander. Lieutenant George Morris agreed relating,

545
00:26:02.700 --> 00:26:05.640
"I can only say that all did their duty

546
00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:08.880
and we sunk with the American flag at the peak."

547
00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:09.930
And another survivor,

548
00:26:09.930 --> 00:26:12.900
Lieutenant Thomas Selfridge will remember

549
00:26:12.900 --> 00:26:14.940
"thus perished the Cumberland.

550
00:26:14.940 --> 00:26:18.180
No vessel ever fought more splendidly against odds

551
00:26:18.180 --> 00:26:22.140
so great that but one result was possible.

552
00:26:22.140 --> 00:26:23.880
She fought to the bitter end

553
00:26:23.880 --> 00:26:26.793
until the waters closed over her last gun."

554
00:26:28.830 --> 00:26:30.480
After sinking USS Cumberland,

555
00:26:30.480 --> 00:26:32.370
Virginia's crew members turned their attention

556
00:26:32.370 --> 00:26:35.760
to the 50 gun sailing frigate USS Congress,

557
00:26:35.760 --> 00:26:37.426
the Confederates' ships

558
00:26:37.426 --> 00:26:39.300
also taking part in the battle.

559
00:26:39.300 --> 00:26:40.800
Patrick Henry, Raleigh

560
00:26:40.800 --> 00:26:44.610
and Bufort joined the ironclad in a devastating attack

561
00:26:44.610 --> 00:26:46.920
that set Congress on fire.

562
00:26:46.920 --> 00:26:49.560
Just after 4:00 PM, a shell fragment from one

563
00:26:49.560 --> 00:26:52.230
of Virginia's guns killed the frigate's commander.

564
00:26:52.230 --> 00:26:54.150
And 20 minutes later, the ship's executive

565
00:26:54.150 --> 00:26:56.220
officer surrendered.

566
00:26:56.220 --> 00:26:58.923
The crew began to abandon ship immediately.

567
00:26:59.940 --> 00:27:02.310
Soldiers at Newport News Pointe opened fire

568
00:27:02.310 --> 00:27:03.330
on Virginia sailors

569
00:27:03.330 --> 00:27:05.550
as they attempted to secure the surrender.

570
00:27:05.550 --> 00:27:08.370
And with a bullet in his leg Flag Officer Franklin Buchanan

571
00:27:08.370 --> 00:27:09.930
angrily ordered his crew

572
00:27:09.930 --> 00:27:13.650
to "fire hotshot into Congress until she glows."

573
00:27:13.650 --> 00:27:16.140
Around 12:40 AM On March 9th,

574
00:27:16.140 --> 00:27:18.780
the fire reached Congress's powder magazine

575
00:27:18.780 --> 00:27:20.313
and the ship exploded.

576
00:27:22.350 --> 00:27:25.260
Now, the next day the Virginia will, of course, will return

577
00:27:25.260 --> 00:27:29.610
to Hampton Roads to destroy the USS Minnesota,

578
00:27:29.610 --> 00:27:31.860
which was helplessly run aground.

579
00:27:31.860 --> 00:27:34.290
Of course, the USS Monitor having arrived

580
00:27:34.290 --> 00:27:37.050
during the night, intercepts Virginia in the famous dual

581
00:27:37.050 --> 00:27:40.260
between the Ironclads. The two ships closed with each other

582
00:27:40.260 --> 00:27:43.350
and pound away for a few hours without a decision.

583
00:27:43.350 --> 00:27:45.360
Often cited as a tactical draw,

584
00:27:45.360 --> 00:27:48.090
strategically, the Monitor has achieved its mission

585
00:27:48.090 --> 00:27:49.380
to protect the Minnesota

586
00:27:49.380 --> 00:27:51.393
and the other vessels in the fleet.

587
00:27:53.130 --> 00:27:56.700
Allowing, this allows George B McClellan to land his army,

588
00:27:56.700 --> 00:27:58.410
the Army of the Potomac at Fort Monroe

589
00:27:58.410 --> 00:28:01.710
and begin the Peninsula campaign a week later,

590
00:28:01.710 --> 00:28:03.360
and I'll close this portion of the talk

591
00:28:03.360 --> 00:28:05.210
by noting this, that the Monitor

592
00:28:05.210 --> 00:28:07.860
and the Virginia pound away at each other for four hours,

593
00:28:07.860 --> 00:28:10.950
famously doing little damage to one another.

594
00:28:10.950 --> 00:28:13.680
But 123 sailors on the Cumberland

595
00:28:13.680 --> 00:28:15.930
and almost an equal amount on the Congress

596
00:28:15.930 --> 00:28:19.260
sacrificed their lives on March 8th, 1862.

597
00:28:19.260 --> 00:28:22.620
Their actions severely weakened CSS Virginia,

598
00:28:22.620 --> 00:28:24.330
Cumberland's particularly.

599
00:28:24.330 --> 00:28:26.850
More so than the Monitors guns.

600
00:28:26.850 --> 00:28:29.640
Much has of course been made of the powerlessness

601
00:28:29.640 --> 00:28:32.790
of wooden ships against iron ones.

602
00:28:32.790 --> 00:28:33.623
But it was Cumberland

603
00:28:33.623 --> 00:28:35.730
and her crew that did the most damage

604
00:28:35.730 --> 00:28:37.710
to the powerful ironclad.

605
00:28:37.710 --> 00:28:40.950
Virginia lost two nine-inch Dahlgren guns

606
00:28:40.950 --> 00:28:43.260
and its ram in the fight.

607
00:28:43.260 --> 00:28:46.680
Fire from the Cumberland also riddled Virginia's smokestack

608
00:28:46.680 --> 00:28:48.510
filling the gun deck with smoke,

609
00:28:48.510 --> 00:28:52.353
but also impairing its maneuverability even further.

610
00:28:53.340 --> 00:28:55.440
With Hampton Roads securely in Union hands

611
00:28:55.440 --> 00:28:57.600
for the rest of the war, Confederate naval forces,

612
00:28:57.600 --> 00:28:59.550
including the once feared CSS Virginia

613
00:28:59.550 --> 00:29:01.530
could do little in the region.

614
00:29:01.530 --> 00:29:03.390
And ultimately when Norfolk is retaken

615
00:29:03.390 --> 00:29:05.820
a few months later, the Confederacy is forced

616
00:29:05.820 --> 00:29:09.660
to destroy Virginia, the ironclad, I should say,

617
00:29:09.660 --> 00:29:11.133
rather than see her captured.

618
00:29:12.060 --> 00:29:14.280
Cumberland survivor, Lieutenant Thomas Selfridge

619
00:29:14.280 --> 00:29:16.560
was correct when he argued,

620
00:29:16.560 --> 00:29:19.560
"I am firmly convinced that the great sacrifice made

621
00:29:19.560 --> 00:29:22.260
for the honor of the flag by the crew of the Cumberland,

622
00:29:22.260 --> 00:29:24.570
though it failed to save the ship,

623
00:29:24.570 --> 00:29:26.640
resulted in the much greater achievement

624
00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:28.170
of saving the fleet.

625
00:29:28.170 --> 00:29:29.523
If not the Union."

626
00:29:33.450 --> 00:29:35.160
Now, after the battle,

627
00:29:35.160 --> 00:29:37.260
the government will express interest in raising

628
00:29:37.260 --> 00:29:39.000
Cumberland's sunken remains

629
00:29:39.000 --> 00:29:41.760
to ascertain if it might be reused.

630
00:29:41.760 --> 00:29:44.880
Ownership of the wreck was never in dispute during the war.

631
00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:48.390
The territorial clause of the US Constitution made it clear

632
00:29:48.390 --> 00:29:51.210
that all US Navy wrecks all over the world

633
00:29:51.210 --> 00:29:52.710
remained property of the Navy.

634
00:29:53.610 --> 00:29:56.970
In May, 1862, Navy Secretary Gideon Wells hired

635
00:29:56.970 --> 00:29:59.970
salvage diver Lauren Bates

636
00:29:59.970 --> 00:30:02.820
to conduct a preliminary examination of the wreck.

637
00:30:02.820 --> 00:30:04.650
And Bates was not optimistic.

638
00:30:04.650 --> 00:30:08.430
He wrote, "the Cumberland lies in 66 feet of water,

639
00:30:08.430 --> 00:30:11.310
deeply embedded in the mud, keeled to an angle

640
00:30:11.310 --> 00:30:13.020
of 45 degrees.

641
00:30:13.020 --> 00:30:14.520
The water is very thick

642
00:30:14.520 --> 00:30:15.960
and it was with some difficulty

643
00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:19.053
that we could get about, everything appears in confusion."

644
00:30:20.220 --> 00:30:22.140
Bates concluded that the damage sustained

645
00:30:22.140 --> 00:30:24.780
by the vessel was too extensive to justify the cost

646
00:30:24.780 --> 00:30:26.790
of raising it and for the next decade,

647
00:30:26.790 --> 00:30:28.470
the government sold the recovery rights

648
00:30:28.470 --> 00:30:30.060
to several salvage firms,

649
00:30:30.060 --> 00:30:31.350
but specified according

650
00:30:31.350 --> 00:30:34.920
to an 1864 Philadelphia Inquirer article

651
00:30:34.920 --> 00:30:38.250
that the Navy would retain all rights to the ship,

652
00:30:38.250 --> 00:30:41.403
including everything of military or historic value.

653
00:30:42.450 --> 00:30:44.310
The article reminded potential divers

654
00:30:44.310 --> 00:30:47.010
that nothing they found on the ship would be theirs.

655
00:30:47.010 --> 00:30:50.400
Stating, "Bidders for this contract will take in

656
00:30:50.400 --> 00:30:51.990
consideration that the government requires

657
00:30:51.990 --> 00:30:54.540
that the frigate Cumberland, actually a sloop of war,

658
00:30:54.540 --> 00:30:57.120
and whatever may be on board of it, either public

659
00:30:57.120 --> 00:30:59.850
or private property, to be delivered at the Navy Yard,

660
00:30:59.850 --> 00:31:01.053
Gosport, Virginia."

661
00:31:01.950 --> 00:31:04.503
And there's a reason I'm going into that detail.

662
00:31:06.000 --> 00:31:08.670
However, such restrictions about artifacts

663
00:31:08.670 --> 00:31:11.490
did not deter daring divers. More than anything,

664
00:31:11.490 --> 00:31:13.290
the government hired salvers wanted

665
00:31:13.290 --> 00:31:15.120
to retrieve the paymaster safe,

666
00:31:15.120 --> 00:31:19.050
which reportedly contained a minimum of $40,000 in gold.

667
00:31:19.050 --> 00:31:21.810
The safe turned out to be something of a hoax.

668
00:31:21.810 --> 00:31:24.480
In 1875, a Detroit salvage company claimed

669
00:31:24.480 --> 00:31:26.463
to have located it but found no gold.

670
00:31:27.390 --> 00:31:28.470
George B. West,

671
00:31:28.470 --> 00:31:31.470
a Newport News resident whose memoirs contained the only

672
00:31:31.470 --> 00:31:32.520
eyewitness accounts

673
00:31:32.520 --> 00:31:35.613
of post Civil War salvage activities in the area observed,

674
00:31:36.600 --> 00:31:38.970
"No one ever knew what was done with the safe.

675
00:31:38.970 --> 00:31:42.480
And it was never reported that any gold was taken from it."

676
00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:45.840
Nevertheless, as years passed, divers continued to believe

677
00:31:45.840 --> 00:31:47.760
that a mysterious Yankee treasure

678
00:31:47.760 --> 00:31:49.740
lay on the bottom of the James River.

679
00:31:49.740 --> 00:31:53.010
During the depression of the 1870s, diving on Cumberland

680
00:31:53.010 --> 00:31:55.470
became something of a get rich quick scheme.

681
00:31:55.470 --> 00:31:58.710
A German diver even used dynamite to blow up parts

682
00:31:58.710 --> 00:32:01.510
of the wreck in hopes of entering the paymaster's cabin.

683
00:32:03.750 --> 00:32:05.370
Now documentary evidence suggests

684
00:32:05.370 --> 00:32:07.800
that all major salvage efforts concluded

685
00:32:07.800 --> 00:32:09.630
within a decade after war's end.

686
00:32:09.630 --> 00:32:11.070
And from that point, the memory

687
00:32:11.070 --> 00:32:13.443
of the Cumberland started to fade.

688
00:32:16.620 --> 00:32:18.180
The only major recovery occurred

689
00:32:18.180 --> 00:32:20.940
around 1910 when a commercial vessel snagged

690
00:32:20.940 --> 00:32:23.460
and recovered Cumberland's anchor chain sending it

691
00:32:23.460 --> 00:32:25.890
to the Museum of the Confederacy in Richmond,

692
00:32:25.890 --> 00:32:27.510
where you can see it today, as part

693
00:32:27.510 --> 00:32:29.913
of the American Civil War Museum at Tredegar.

694
00:32:30.810 --> 00:32:32.580
For the next 60 to 70 years,

695
00:32:32.580 --> 00:32:35.700
there's no documented activity that took place on Cumberland

696
00:32:35.700 --> 00:32:38.730
or the nearby CSS Florida wreck.

697
00:32:38.730 --> 00:32:41.460
Though unsanctioned diving and or recovery

698
00:32:41.460 --> 00:32:42.663
certainly occurred.

699
00:32:44.400 --> 00:32:46.470
In 1980, this started to change.

700
00:32:46.470 --> 00:32:49.440
Official interest in the wrecks began anew.

701
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:50.910
So many years had passed

702
00:32:50.910 --> 00:32:53.220
that the wrecks had to be relocated.

703
00:32:53.220 --> 00:32:55.980
Now the Navy may have been reluctant to relocate, excuse me,

704
00:32:55.980 --> 00:32:57.900
to locate the wrecks, possibly assuming it

705
00:32:57.900 --> 00:32:59.430
would've emboldened plunder.

706
00:32:59.430 --> 00:33:02.070
But popular novelist, Clive Cussler, famous

707
00:33:02.070 --> 00:33:05.640
for his book 'Raised the Titanic', was highly motivated

708
00:33:05.640 --> 00:33:08.283
to locate, recover, and preserve this history.

709
00:33:10.380 --> 00:33:12.900
At the time, Cussler served as Chairman of the Board

710
00:33:12.900 --> 00:33:16.816
of the National Underwater and Marine Agency or NUMA.

711
00:33:16.816 --> 00:33:18.960
It's a private nonprofit organization dedicated

712
00:33:18.960 --> 00:33:21.010
to the preservation of maritime heritage.

713
00:33:22.050 --> 00:33:24.090
He hired a Washington based researcher

714
00:33:24.090 --> 00:33:26.040
and contacted a local historian

715
00:33:26.040 --> 00:33:27.900
who calculated probable locations

716
00:33:27.900 --> 00:33:30.180
for the sunken vessels based on the correlation

717
00:33:30.180 --> 00:33:32.220
of 19th century landmarks

718
00:33:32.220 --> 00:33:34.380
with corresponding structures currently standing

719
00:33:34.380 --> 00:33:36.080
along the Newport News waterfront.

720
00:33:37.080 --> 00:33:40.410
Cussler then entered into a cooperative arrangement

721
00:33:40.410 --> 00:33:42.960
with the Virginia Research Center for Archeology,

722
00:33:42.960 --> 00:33:45.660
which offered to supply diving archeologists to search

723
00:33:45.660 --> 00:33:47.280
for the two wreck sites.

724
00:33:47.280 --> 00:33:51.033
He did not coordinate any activity with the Navy, however.

725
00:33:53.640 --> 00:33:55.410
Unable to find the wrecks even

726
00:33:55.410 --> 00:33:57.990
with the latest surveying equipment at their disposal,

727
00:33:57.990 --> 00:33:59.070
NUMA contracted

728
00:33:59.070 --> 00:34:01.800
with the Underwater Archeological Joint Ventures,

729
00:34:01.800 --> 00:34:03.453
a firm based in Yorktown.

730
00:34:04.410 --> 00:34:06.990
The Joint Ventures firm began searching in the vicinity

731
00:34:06.990 --> 00:34:08.370
of the Horn Brothers Shipyard

732
00:34:08.370 --> 00:34:10.050
and the Virginia Port Authority piers.

733
00:34:10.050 --> 00:34:14.520
You'll see those in the Navy map that's on the slide now.

734
00:34:14.520 --> 00:34:18.723
Project members also contacted local watermen,

735
00:34:19.740 --> 00:34:22.980
charter boat captains, clamors and crabbers.

736
00:34:22.980 --> 00:34:24.840
And they were hoping to obtain information

737
00:34:24.840 --> 00:34:26.430
about the recovery of artifacts

738
00:34:26.430 --> 00:34:28.770
or irregularities in the river bottom

739
00:34:28.770 --> 00:34:31.323
that might indicate the presence of a wreck site.

740
00:34:33.150 --> 00:34:35.670
Wilbur Reilly, a veteran clammer of the York

741
00:34:35.670 --> 00:34:37.680
and James River, knew the location

742
00:34:37.680 --> 00:34:40.530
of the wreck near port authorities Pier C,

743
00:34:40.530 --> 00:34:42.150
this is Cumberland's wreck.

744
00:34:42.150 --> 00:34:45.000
Riley admitted that he had already retrieved a number

745
00:34:45.000 --> 00:34:46.413
of objects from it.

746
00:34:47.962 --> 00:34:51.030
He described how he first discovered the wreck four

747
00:34:51.030 --> 00:34:53.640
or five years earlier when he lost a pair

748
00:34:53.640 --> 00:34:55.800
of clam tongues in the James River

749
00:34:55.800 --> 00:34:57.720
and how in an effort to retrieve them,

750
00:34:57.720 --> 00:35:01.590
he recovered a brass sword handle decorated with an eagle

751
00:35:01.590 --> 00:35:04.800
and a fish scale pattern, a design emblematic

752
00:35:04.800 --> 00:35:06.543
of the US Navy in the Civil War.

753
00:35:08.460 --> 00:35:11.730
Riley had also tongs from the site a large copper alloy

754
00:35:11.730 --> 00:35:14.850
cylinder, which bore a striking resemblance to a section

755
00:35:14.850 --> 00:35:17.280
of bilge pump pipe depicted in the builder's

756
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:19.590
plans of USS Cumberland.

757
00:35:19.590 --> 00:35:22.290
Furthermore, Riley estimated the depth of the wreckage

758
00:35:22.290 --> 00:35:25.890
to about 65 feet, very close to the figure submitted

759
00:35:25.890 --> 00:35:28.413
by Lauren Bates back in 1862.

760
00:35:31.800 --> 00:35:34.494
And without the benefit of instruments,

761
00:35:34.494 --> 00:35:36.240
Riley took his clam boat

762
00:35:36.240 --> 00:35:39.270
and led the team, Cussler's team, to the wreck.

763
00:35:39.270 --> 00:35:40.920
Using his visual calculation

764
00:35:40.920 --> 00:35:43.710
of land bearings, sweeping the riverbed,

765
00:35:43.710 --> 00:35:47.100
they encountered an area of concentrated wreckage dominated

766
00:35:47.100 --> 00:35:50.310
by massive wooden timbers, protruding eerily out

767
00:35:50.310 --> 00:35:52.590
of the mud at odd angles.

768
00:35:52.590 --> 00:35:56.220
There they found a white iron stone plate fragment

769
00:35:56.220 --> 00:35:59.190
bearing a manufacturer's name and his mark.

770
00:35:59.190 --> 00:36:01.050
They established the shard as a product

771
00:36:01.050 --> 00:36:03.183
of the Staffordshire potteries in England.

772
00:36:04.860 --> 00:36:07.050
Interestingly enough, the John Alcock Firm,

773
00:36:07.050 --> 00:36:10.020
which you see on the back mark there was only in business

774
00:36:10.020 --> 00:36:12.180
for a very short time in the 1850s.

775
00:36:12.180 --> 00:36:16.800
So it was very clear from that plate that they were

776
00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:19.530
above Cumberland 'cause Cumberland you know,

777
00:36:19.530 --> 00:36:22.353
didn't exist after 1862.

778
00:36:23.430 --> 00:36:25.920
They also found a remarkably well-preserved pair

779
00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:27.570
of brass gunner's calipers.

780
00:36:27.570 --> 00:36:29.310
A device used to measure the diameter

781
00:36:29.310 --> 00:36:30.910
of cannon bores and projectiles.

782
00:36:31.980 --> 00:36:36.180
Divers also found a Sabo, a circular block of wood

783
00:36:36.180 --> 00:36:39.510
with a flat lower surface and a concave upper one.

784
00:36:39.510 --> 00:36:41.070
And the Sabo was used to ensure

785
00:36:41.070 --> 00:36:43.830
that a ball would be seated in the breach of a cannon bore

786
00:36:43.830 --> 00:36:47.460
with the fuse facing toward the muzzle in order

787
00:36:47.460 --> 00:36:51.030
to prevent explosion in the tube upon firing.

788
00:36:51.030 --> 00:36:52.860
The Sabo's most intriguing feature,

789
00:36:52.860 --> 00:36:56.400
however, was its nine-inch diameter, which corresponded

790
00:36:56.400 --> 00:36:59.820
to the bore of the 22 smooth bore guns

791
00:36:59.820 --> 00:37:03.090
that constituted Cumberland's broadside battery.

792
00:37:03.090 --> 00:37:04.140
The evidence suggested

793
00:37:04.140 --> 00:37:08.130
that the wreck was the final resting place of USS Cumberland

794
00:37:08.130 --> 00:37:09.660
and with the wreck located,

795
00:37:09.660 --> 00:37:11.970
they quickly found the CSS Florida

796
00:37:11.970 --> 00:37:14.223
off the Horn Brothers Shipyard nearby.

797
00:37:16.380 --> 00:37:20.070
As the salvage divers had noted back in 1865,

798
00:37:20.070 --> 00:37:23.220
reaching the wrecks of Cumberland and Florida was not easy.

799
00:37:23.220 --> 00:37:27.030
Environmental circumstances posed formidable obstacles,

800
00:37:27.030 --> 00:37:29.280
swift currents and poor visibility hindered

801
00:37:29.280 --> 00:37:33.090
almost all aspects of underwater operations.

802
00:37:33.090 --> 00:37:36.960
Water depth over 60 feet at both sides restricted daily

803
00:37:36.960 --> 00:37:40.500
bottom time with decompression stops to barely over an hour

804
00:37:40.500 --> 00:37:43.050
for each member of the four-man dive team.

805
00:37:43.050 --> 00:37:45.180
The hulls and propeller blades

806
00:37:45.180 --> 00:37:46.560
of the freighters, tankers

807
00:37:46.560 --> 00:37:48.870
and barges that regularly made their way up

808
00:37:48.870 --> 00:37:52.500
and down the river represented a constant source of concern

809
00:37:52.500 --> 00:37:55.143
to divers during their ascent and descent.

810
00:37:56.160 --> 00:37:58.500
But by far the greatest cause

811
00:37:58.500 --> 00:38:00.930
of consternation was the frequent disappearance

812
00:38:00.930 --> 00:38:02.160
of sight marking buoys,

813
00:38:02.160 --> 00:38:03.720
which were inadvertently dragged away

814
00:38:03.720 --> 00:38:05.880
by passing vessels during the night.

815
00:38:05.880 --> 00:38:08.643
This is a very active site on a shipping channel.

816
00:38:10.020 --> 00:38:12.600
They found Florida in a more undisturbed condition while

817
00:38:12.600 --> 00:38:14.700
Cumberland was barely held together

818
00:38:14.700 --> 00:38:17.070
and the damage sustained by the Union warship

819
00:38:17.070 --> 00:38:18.330
during its violent encounter

820
00:38:18.330 --> 00:38:20.790
with the Virginia, subsequently compounded

821
00:38:20.790 --> 00:38:22.950
by the destructive efforts of salvaged divers

822
00:38:22.950 --> 00:38:25.530
and passing ships over the decades, accounted

823
00:38:25.530 --> 00:38:27.930
for the vessel's shattered state.

824
00:38:27.930 --> 00:38:31.500
Furthermore, at some point an enormous quantity

825
00:38:31.500 --> 00:38:33.933
of dirt from dredging was dumped over the wreck.

826
00:38:36.570 --> 00:38:39.570
Even so, Cumberland still possessed unique artifacts

827
00:38:39.570 --> 00:38:42.750
that would help preserve the memory of the crew's sacrifice.

828
00:38:42.750 --> 00:38:46.140
Cussler's crew recovered a small wooden frame custom fitted

829
00:38:46.140 --> 00:38:49.560
around a broken piece of mirror-glass fashion, no doubt

830
00:38:49.560 --> 00:38:51.930
by a crew member for his personal use

831
00:38:51.930 --> 00:38:55.890
and magnificent ship's bell, one and a half feet high

832
00:38:55.890 --> 00:38:57.630
and cast in bronze.

833
00:38:57.630 --> 00:38:59.640
This was the bell that rang on the morning

834
00:38:59.640 --> 00:39:04.053
of March 8th, 1862, to send the crew to general quarters.

835
00:39:04.920 --> 00:39:08.130
And yet these incredible discoveries prompted a protracted

836
00:39:08.130 --> 00:39:11.310
legal battle as news of the recovery spread

837
00:39:11.310 --> 00:39:13.050
and the artifacts were not turned over

838
00:39:13.050 --> 00:39:15.633
to the Navy, controversy struck.

839
00:39:21.270 --> 00:39:23.310
It looks like I'm at the 40-minute mark.

840
00:39:23.310 --> 00:39:26.520
I'm gonna try to wrap up a little bit quickly

841
00:39:26.520 --> 00:39:28.530
so that we have time for questions.

842
00:39:28.530 --> 00:39:33.530
So the Navy catches wind of Cussler's activity.

843
00:39:34.410 --> 00:39:36.300
He is very carefully

844
00:39:36.300 --> 00:39:38.670
and responsibly turning over these artifacts

845
00:39:38.670 --> 00:39:42.270
to the College of William and Mary for conservation,

846
00:39:42.270 --> 00:39:44.763
and he expects them to go somewhere in Virginia.

847
00:39:46.230 --> 00:39:50.190
Now the Navy at the time doesn't have a permitting process

848
00:39:50.190 --> 00:39:52.140
for the diving on ships,

849
00:39:52.140 --> 00:39:57.140
and it also does not do a great job educating historians,

850
00:39:57.150 --> 00:40:01.260
archeologists, divers, watermen about shipwrecks.

851
00:40:01.260 --> 00:40:03.270
Again, this is in the 1980s.

852
00:40:03.270 --> 00:40:04.920
So Cussler is really surprised

853
00:40:04.920 --> 00:40:07.620
and angered upon finding out the Navy

854
00:40:07.620 --> 00:40:10.068
wants the artifacts back.

855
00:40:10.068 --> 00:40:12.049
For months he refuses.

856
00:40:12.049 --> 00:40:14.610
He argues because he went down to get them

857
00:40:14.610 --> 00:40:18.660
and he could give the artifacts to whoever he wanted.

858
00:40:18.660 --> 00:40:21.840
The Navy's Judge Advocate Corps gets involved

859
00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:23.907
and the then director of the Hampton Roads Naval Museum

860
00:40:23.907 --> 00:40:26.313
who you see there in our original site,

861
00:40:27.405 --> 00:40:30.944
they threatened Cussler, excuse me,

862
00:40:30.944 --> 00:40:33.420
with hefty fines and jail time.

863
00:40:33.420 --> 00:40:37.388
And ultimately, the artifacts do go back to the Navy.

864
00:40:37.388 --> 00:40:40.950
Cussler never really forgives the Navy for this.

865
00:40:40.950 --> 00:40:44.340
And he writes a scathing account in his 1996 book,

866
00:40:44.340 --> 00:40:47.280
the 'Sea Hunters', and I won't go into some of his comments

867
00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:48.723
'cause we are short on time.

868
00:40:49.860 --> 00:40:53.070
Unfortunately, for Cutler, though, I keep calling 'em

869
00:40:53.070 --> 00:40:55.440
that Cussler, the US Navy,

870
00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:57.360
they weren't terribly communicative,

871
00:40:57.360 --> 00:40:59.610
proactive, or assertive,

872
00:40:59.610 --> 00:41:02.550
but the law was still on their side.

873
00:41:02.550 --> 00:41:05.460
The Constitution's property clause filed

874
00:41:05.460 --> 00:41:09.780
by the Abandoned Shipwrecked Acts of 1987,

875
00:41:09.780 --> 00:41:13.113
placed ownership of the vessels firmly within the US Navy.

876
00:41:17.880 --> 00:41:21.870
Creating further chaos is that now that the location

877
00:41:21.870 --> 00:41:22.890
of the wrecks is public

878
00:41:22.890 --> 00:41:27.390
and in the news, most Virginia watermen are going

879
00:41:27.390 --> 00:41:31.230
to decide that, well, if the Navy doesn't own the wrecks,

880
00:41:31.230 --> 00:41:34.293
we can therefore take artifacts from the sites.

881
00:41:35.940 --> 00:41:38.335
They do seize as many artifacts as they can

882
00:41:38.335 --> 00:41:41.010
before the Navy tried to protect the vessels

883
00:41:41.010 --> 00:41:43.170
with greater action.For the next 10 years,

884
00:41:43.170 --> 00:41:45.840
locals repeatedly looted the Cumberland

885
00:41:45.840 --> 00:41:48.690
and Florida wrecks, building their own private collections

886
00:41:48.690 --> 00:41:51.810
of material in the process.

887
00:41:51.810 --> 00:41:54.840
While troubling for those of us in historic preservation

888
00:41:54.840 --> 00:41:56.100
is even more upsetting

889
00:41:56.100 --> 00:41:59.190
that the Cumberland Wreck is a war grave, hollowed ground

890
00:41:59.190 --> 00:42:03.153
with many of the 123 men killed aboard, buried within.

891
00:42:04.770 --> 00:42:05.883
As you see there,

892
00:42:09.278 --> 00:42:10.890
there is an advertisement in sort

893
00:42:10.890 --> 00:42:14.319
of a Civil War collector's magazine revealing

894
00:42:14.319 --> 00:42:16.740
that they have relics from of ships,

895
00:42:16.740 --> 00:42:19.920
brass from the CSS Florida and the Cumberland,

896
00:42:19.920 --> 00:42:22.720
and they're being melted down to create re-enactor's

897
00:42:22.720 --> 00:42:26.220
Confederate Navy belt buckles for sale.

898
00:42:26.220 --> 00:42:28.140
So not only are they taking these things,

899
00:42:28.140 --> 00:42:29.970
they're destroying them, melting them down

900
00:42:29.970 --> 00:42:32.010
and creating something else with them

901
00:42:32.010 --> 00:42:34.923
as it's clearly marked there in the advertisement.

902
00:42:37.560 --> 00:42:42.415
Now these watermen are prosecuted.

903
00:42:42.415 --> 00:42:45.756
The artifacts are recovered by the Navy

904
00:42:45.756 --> 00:42:48.720
in another protracted legal battle.

905
00:42:48.720 --> 00:42:51.090
No one believes the story that they didn't know

906
00:42:51.090 --> 00:42:52.480
what these items were

907
00:42:53.564 --> 00:42:58.290
and they are sentenced most importantly

908
00:42:58.290 --> 00:43:02.730
amongst other fines to return all of the artifacts

909
00:43:02.730 --> 00:43:04.380
to the Navy.

910
00:43:04.380 --> 00:43:06.000
Upon their return, the director

911
00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:08.783
of naval history designates the Hampton Roads Naval Museum

912
00:43:08.783 --> 00:43:11.790
as the Navy's repository for this collection.

913
00:43:11.790 --> 00:43:14.310
And the looted artifacts were either dried out once removed

914
00:43:14.310 --> 00:43:17.670
from the water or as you see there, coated in a thick layer

915
00:43:17.670 --> 00:43:18.813
of polyurethane.

916
00:43:20.400 --> 00:43:23.250
In the 90s and the early 2000s, the museum

917
00:43:23.250 --> 00:43:25.320
embarks on an inventory

918
00:43:25.320 --> 00:43:28.367
and a conservation assessment that most

919
00:43:28.367 --> 00:43:31.710
of these artifacts are turned over

920
00:43:31.710 --> 00:43:34.950
to the Warren Lasch Conservation Center in Charleston,

921
00:43:34.950 --> 00:43:37.170
South Carolina, the home of the Hunley.

922
00:43:37.170 --> 00:43:39.450
They undergo cleaning, desalinization

923
00:43:39.450 --> 00:43:41.400
and controlled air drying

924
00:43:41.400 --> 00:43:44.370
and where possible some pieces are joined together

925
00:43:44.370 --> 00:43:46.863
and markings created by the looters removed.

926
00:43:47.940 --> 00:43:49.890
And you can see there the effects of it.

927
00:43:49.890 --> 00:43:53.190
That block there is the way it looks today vice when it

928
00:43:53.190 --> 00:43:55.143
was turned over by the looters.

929
00:43:59.850 --> 00:44:03.990
in the 90s, the Navy steps up and begins more serious

930
00:44:03.990 --> 00:44:07.920
and proactive archeological study of the wrecks.

931
00:44:07.920 --> 00:44:10.050
Real quick, they do so in,

932
00:44:10.050 --> 00:44:13.560
and when I say we, I mean the Navy Historical Center,

933
00:44:13.560 --> 00:44:14.610
now known as Naval History

934
00:44:14.610 --> 00:44:17.160
and Heritage Command's Underwater Archeology branch

935
00:44:17.160 --> 00:44:19.710
and also the Hampton Roads Naval Museum.

936
00:44:19.710 --> 00:44:21.840
NOOA takes part in some of these

937
00:44:21.840 --> 00:44:25.830
and local navy commands as well, such as salvage divers.

938
00:44:25.830 --> 00:44:26.943
On a few occasions.

939
00:44:28.650 --> 00:44:30.330
They begin diving on the wreck.

940
00:44:30.330 --> 00:44:31.800
They begin studying the wreck,

941
00:44:31.800 --> 00:44:35.763
they produce studies in the mid-80s in 1987,

942
00:44:36.772 --> 00:44:40.620
there's one in 1993,

943
00:44:40.620 --> 00:44:42.603
there's an inventory created.

944
00:44:43.950 --> 00:44:48.030
There is different technologies.

945
00:44:48.030 --> 00:44:51.180
Sonar is used eventually in 2000,

946
00:44:53.160 --> 00:44:56.850
the 2007 report there is remote camera.

947
00:44:56.850 --> 00:44:59.710
And you can see there the discovery of the water tanks

948
00:45:00.660 --> 00:45:04.260
that that gave historians

949
00:45:04.260 --> 00:45:07.680
and the archeologists a better understanding of

950
00:45:07.680 --> 00:45:09.603
Cumberland's stowage plan.

951
00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:13.770
The other good news in all

952
00:45:13.770 --> 00:45:16.440
of this is while the Navy is doing more work

953
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:19.653
to do more study on the wrecks themselves,

954
00:45:21.090 --> 00:45:23.583
there's also a lot going on behind the scenes.

955
00:45:25.590 --> 00:45:29.310
Specifically, the Navy recognizes

956
00:45:29.310 --> 00:45:31.260
that the current laws don't do enough

957
00:45:31.260 --> 00:45:34.380
to protect their shipwrecks.

958
00:45:34.380 --> 00:45:37.170
And finally, due to the efforts of the Navy

959
00:45:37.170 --> 00:45:39.093
and other organizations,

960
00:45:41.139 --> 00:45:45.330
the 2004 Sunken Military Craft Act is signed into law.

961
00:45:45.330 --> 00:45:46.980
And this act protects ships

962
00:45:46.980 --> 00:45:49.770
and planes belonging to the armed services from any

963
00:45:49.770 --> 00:45:51.243
unauthorized disturbance.

964
00:45:52.110 --> 00:45:55.410
This includes all vessels sunk in American waters,

965
00:45:55.410 --> 00:45:58.260
including all foreign military craft.

966
00:45:58.260 --> 00:45:59.340
And pursuant to the law,

967
00:45:59.340 --> 00:46:02.130
the Navy sunken military craft remains property

968
00:46:02.130 --> 00:46:04.710
of the US Navy, regardless of its location

969
00:46:04.710 --> 00:46:06.390
or the passage of time,

970
00:46:06.390 --> 00:46:09.030
and may not be disturbed without permission

971
00:46:09.030 --> 00:46:10.263
from the US Navy.

972
00:46:11.100 --> 00:46:13.920
The act also allows the heads of each military service

973
00:46:13.920 --> 00:46:16.440
to begin a permitting program allowing people

974
00:46:16.440 --> 00:46:20.010
to dive on the wrecks for archeological, educational

975
00:46:20.010 --> 00:46:21.600
or historic purposes,

976
00:46:21.600 --> 00:46:25.710
provided they do nothing to disturb the sites.

977
00:46:25.710 --> 00:46:28.920
And today,

978
00:46:28.920 --> 00:46:33.330
despite some of the horror stories about illegal recovery,

979
00:46:33.330 --> 00:46:35.913
these are the artifacts today in our new exhibit,

980
00:46:39.210 --> 00:46:41.490
and I'll close with this,

981
00:46:41.490 --> 00:46:43.950
that the artifacts from Cumberland and Florida,

982
00:46:43.950 --> 00:46:46.710
they're a treasured part of our collection.

983
00:46:46.710 --> 00:46:50.010
They've been identified, they've been conserved,

984
00:46:50.010 --> 00:46:51.690
they've been interpreted for the benefit

985
00:46:51.690 --> 00:46:53.340
of future generations.

986
00:46:53.340 --> 00:46:55.590
And many of them now are, at long last,

987
00:46:55.590 --> 00:46:57.600
are on exhibit for the first time.

988
00:46:57.600 --> 00:47:00.210
I hope you can stop by the museum to spend some time

989
00:47:00.210 --> 00:47:03.450
with them and learn about the navies in the Civil War

990
00:47:03.450 --> 00:47:06.840
and the sacrifices of sailors then and now.

991
00:47:06.840 --> 00:47:10.590
Thank you very much and I'm happy to take any questions.

992
00:47:13.710 --> 00:47:15.930
<v ->Okay, thank you John.</v>

993
00:47:15.930 --> 00:47:16.763
That was great.

994
00:47:16.763 --> 00:47:18.630
You actually made some very good points

995
00:47:18.630 --> 00:47:20.520
that I had never considered before

996
00:47:20.520 --> 00:47:23.940
and that was how much the Cumberland, the damage that it did

997
00:47:23.940 --> 00:47:26.850
before the actual Battle of Hampton Roads.

998
00:47:26.850 --> 00:47:30.600
So thank you Jessie.

999
00:47:30.600 --> 00:47:32.643
So anyway, I really appreciate that,

1000
00:47:34.013 --> 00:47:35.640
so one of the questions that we have is

1001
00:47:35.640 --> 00:47:38.280
how many ships actually sank on March the 8th?

1002
00:47:38.280 --> 00:47:39.690
How many Union ships sank?

1003
00:47:39.690 --> 00:47:41.100
We know no Confederates did,

1004
00:47:41.100 --> 00:47:43.860
but how many Union ships sank on March the 8th

1005
00:47:43.860 --> 00:47:45.183
and then on March the 9th?

1006
00:47:46.263 --> 00:47:51.263
<v ->On the 8th, it's Cumberland and Congress.</v>

1007
00:47:51.540 --> 00:47:54.483
Congress explodes and is completely destroyed.

1008
00:47:56.055 --> 00:47:59.430
No one else sinks.

1009
00:47:59.430 --> 00:48:01.470
And on the second day the same,

1010
00:48:01.470 --> 00:48:04.410
the second day is basically Monitor and Virginia

1011
00:48:04.410 --> 00:48:05.880
and after four hours of fighting,

1012
00:48:05.880 --> 00:48:08.553
they both retire from the scene.

1013
00:48:09.900 --> 00:48:11.880
There's many vessels involved kind

1014
00:48:11.880 --> 00:48:14.430
of taking shots where they can.

1015
00:48:14.430 --> 00:48:16.833
The Patrick Henry, the Teaser,

1016
00:48:17.685 --> 00:48:20.793
the Union side, the Roanoke,

1017
00:48:21.810 --> 00:48:24.000
there's another smaller ship whose name escapes

1018
00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:25.470
me right now.

1019
00:48:25.470 --> 00:48:28.170
They take fire the Virginia at various times,

1020
00:48:28.170 --> 00:48:30.900
but really to no effect.

1021
00:48:30.900 --> 00:48:31.860
<v ->Okay.</v>

1022
00:48:31.860 --> 00:48:34.230
Jessie, do you have any questions?

1023
00:48:34.230 --> 00:48:37.337
<v ->One came up that asks was the ram</v>

1024
00:48:37.337 --> 00:48:40.263
of the CSS Virginia ever looked for?

1025
00:48:42.810 --> 00:48:45.270
<v ->Whether or not it was officially looked for,</v>

1026
00:48:45.270 --> 00:48:47.046
we don't know.

1027
00:48:47.046 --> 00:48:49.290
What we do know, no one has claimed it

1028
00:48:49.290 --> 00:48:52.413
and it has never officially been found.

1029
00:48:54.900 --> 00:48:57.630
The Cumberland wreck is a disaster.

1030
00:48:57.630 --> 00:49:00.990
So if no one brought it up early on

1031
00:49:00.990 --> 00:49:05.640
and I suspect not, then it's, you're not gonna find it

1032
00:49:05.640 --> 00:49:09.156
because the ship, there's so much spillage onto it

1033
00:49:09.156 --> 00:49:13.020
from dredging, you really can't tell.

1034
00:49:13.020 --> 00:49:15.660
And I learned from my study, I hadn't really,

1035
00:49:15.660 --> 00:49:18.570
the ram is 1500 pounds, but it's not that big.

1036
00:49:18.570 --> 00:49:22.590
It's only two feet by 12 maybe, depending.

1037
00:49:22.590 --> 00:49:25.680
And the part that broke off is even smaller than that.

1038
00:49:25.680 --> 00:49:27.480
According to studies of the weight

1039
00:49:27.480 --> 00:49:29.580
of cast iron in those times, anything

1040
00:49:29.580 --> 00:49:32.133
that was 1500 pounds could not have been that big.

1041
00:49:33.720 --> 00:49:35.070
<v ->Okay.</v>

1042
00:49:35.070 --> 00:49:37.410
I didn't realize it was that small.

1043
00:49:37.410 --> 00:49:38.880
So that's good.

1044
00:49:38.880 --> 00:49:41.250
Another question that I have is,

1045
00:49:41.250 --> 00:49:43.680
if somebody should figure out that they do have one

1046
00:49:43.680 --> 00:49:46.950
of those items that was sold from melted down

1047
00:49:46.950 --> 00:49:49.950
artifacts, what should they do?

1048
00:49:49.950 --> 00:49:51.420
Are they in trouble?

1049
00:49:51.420 --> 00:49:52.650
<v ->No, they're not in trouble.</v>

1050
00:49:52.650 --> 00:49:54.633
They should call the museum.

1051
00:49:55.890 --> 00:49:58.653
We have a box of about a hundred of them, I should say.

1052
00:50:01.080 --> 00:50:02.100
You should call the museum.

1053
00:50:02.100 --> 00:50:03.420
Absolutely.

1054
00:50:03.420 --> 00:50:06.170
We are the repository for anything that was brought up,

1055
00:50:07.320 --> 00:50:08.460
no questions asked.

1056
00:50:08.460 --> 00:50:12.210
We'll just take care of it.

1057
00:50:12.210 --> 00:50:13.500
<v ->Okay and I know with some</v>

1058
00:50:13.500 --> 00:50:16.620
of the other shipwrecks on the North Carolina coast,

1059
00:50:16.620 --> 00:50:19.080
this question has come up before about amnesty.

1060
00:50:19.080 --> 00:50:21.720
What if somebody has brought up artifacts in the past,

1061
00:50:21.720 --> 00:50:23.640
like in the 70s or 60s?

1062
00:50:23.640 --> 00:50:26.440
Is there an amnesty program where they can turn them in?

1063
00:50:28.410 --> 00:50:30.665
<v ->I'm sorry, I don't know the answer to that.</v>

1064
00:50:30.665 --> 00:50:32.970
<v ->Okay.</v>
<v ->But we can find out.</v>

1065
00:50:32.970 --> 00:50:34.470
<v ->Okay.</v>

1066
00:50:34.470 --> 00:50:37.100
Jessie, any other questions for you?

1067
00:50:37.100 --> 00:50:39.600
<v ->I do have a couple questions.</v>

1068
00:50:39.600 --> 00:50:43.470
I'm curious to know why there's a discrepancy on

1069
00:50:43.470 --> 00:50:47.730
who were survivors and who perished in the shipwreck.

1070
00:50:47.730 --> 00:50:49.620
I know you said there's two

1071
00:50:49.620 --> 00:50:51.330
that sometimes are not included.

1072
00:50:51.330 --> 00:50:52.533
How did that happen?

1073
00:50:53.514 --> 00:50:57.570
<v ->So a lot of the records that were on Cumberland obviously</v>

1074
00:50:57.570 --> 00:50:59.610
go down with the ship, you know,

1075
00:50:59.610 --> 00:51:01.310
muster rolls and things like that.

1076
00:51:02.340 --> 00:51:04.290
As survivors begin to amass,

1077
00:51:04.290 --> 00:51:07.500
the commanding officer is charged with, you know,

1078
00:51:07.500 --> 00:51:10.833
sort of creating a new muster roll of survivors.

1079
00:51:12.694 --> 00:51:16.320
He leaves off

1080
00:51:16.320 --> 00:51:19.030
of this list in which you can count

1081
00:51:19.980 --> 00:51:24.603
121 people, the masters mate, John Harrington,

1082
00:51:25.740 --> 00:51:28.170
and the chaplain John Lenhardt,

1083
00:51:28.170 --> 00:51:30.090
both of whom are never seen again.

1084
00:51:30.090 --> 00:51:34.980
And there are eyewitness accounts of them.

1085
00:51:34.980 --> 00:51:37.260
Well, Harrington is killed

1086
00:51:37.260 --> 00:51:40.920
and gruesomely killed, the chaplain goes down

1087
00:51:40.920 --> 00:51:44.283
with the ship and is seen doing so,

1088
00:51:45.960 --> 00:51:49.680
so their names are not part of that 121.

1089
00:51:49.680 --> 00:51:51.183
So we have added them back,

1090
00:51:52.590 --> 00:51:54.150
but everybody just goes to, oh,

1091
00:51:54.150 --> 00:51:56.850
the commander said 121, it's 121.

1092
00:51:56.850 --> 00:51:59.450
And it just gets repeated and repeated and repeated.

1093
00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:02.280
<v ->Good point.</v>

1094
00:52:02.280 --> 00:52:03.570
One other question that came in,

1095
00:52:03.570 --> 00:52:05.550
is this the Hampton Roads exhibit available

1096
00:52:05.550 --> 00:52:08.100
for viewing online in any way?

1097
00:52:08.100 --> 00:52:12.660
<v ->It will be very, it's very soon,</v>

1098
00:52:12.660 --> 00:52:14.700
probably about two weeks.

1099
00:52:14.700 --> 00:52:17.040
And if you go on our website now,

1100
00:52:17.040 --> 00:52:18.330
it's called Matterport.

1101
00:52:18.330 --> 00:52:20.010
A lot of real estate companies use it.

1102
00:52:20.010 --> 00:52:22.380
It's a very sort

1103
00:52:22.380 --> 00:52:26.160
of intensive virtual museum experience where you can go

1104
00:52:26.160 --> 00:52:28.590
through and look at labels, look at artifacts,

1105
00:52:28.590 --> 00:52:30.873
and listen to video if there's video,

1106
00:52:31.770 --> 00:52:35.250
it's truly a virtual exhibit experience.

1107
00:52:35.250 --> 00:52:37.320
You can see what we've done for the Vietnam War.

1108
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:39.270
And in a couple of weeks we'll have a link up

1109
00:52:39.270 --> 00:52:41.820
for the Battle of Hampton Roads exhibit.

1110
00:52:41.820 --> 00:52:43.050
<v ->Very nice.</v>

1111
00:52:43.050 --> 00:52:44.940
Jessie, any other questions?

1112
00:52:44.940 --> 00:52:48.090
<v ->Yes another one came up that said,</v>

1113
00:52:48.090 --> 00:52:50.820
where is the Cumberland wreck in relation

1114
00:52:50.820 --> 00:52:53.703
to the Monitor and Merrimack Bridge?

1115
00:52:54.630 --> 00:52:57.190
<v ->Okay, so west</v>

1116
00:52:59.675 --> 00:53:02.373
on the other side of Newport News Point,

1117
00:53:03.654 --> 00:53:06.990
I'm not sure the distance from the bridge,

1118
00:53:06.990 --> 00:53:08.550
but if you are looking at a map

1119
00:53:08.550 --> 00:53:12.510
of Newport News at the waterfront where the piers are

1120
00:53:12.510 --> 00:53:14.013
thereabouts,

1121
00:53:18.660 --> 00:53:22.590
maybe a couple of hundred yards away from the shore.

1122
00:53:22.590 --> 00:53:26.218
And they are a

1123
00:53:26.218 --> 00:53:30.090
couple of hundred feet away from each other.

1124
00:53:30.090 --> 00:53:32.220
So they're very close and can be,

1125
00:53:32.220 --> 00:53:36.063
but I'm not sure about the distance from the actual bridge.

1126
00:53:36.930 --> 00:53:38.310
<v ->Okay.</v>

1127
00:53:38.310 --> 00:53:41.610
Just also as some information for everyone is that,

1128
00:53:41.610 --> 00:53:43.710
if you go to Newport News Point,

1129
00:53:43.710 --> 00:53:45.870
there are three interpretive signs there

1130
00:53:45.870 --> 00:53:47.520
that NOOA put there about five

1131
00:53:47.520 --> 00:53:50.400
or six years ago that actually very much,

1132
00:53:50.400 --> 00:53:52.440
I mean they have very good detail on the battle

1133
00:53:52.440 --> 00:53:56.820
and where all the ships are at or at and are at today.

1134
00:53:56.820 --> 00:53:59.370
Okay we had one other question come in.

1135
00:53:59.370 --> 00:54:01.470
How do you get the story

1136
00:54:01.470 --> 00:54:03.633
of the Cumberland into school curriculum?

1137
00:54:04.710 --> 00:54:06.120
<v ->We do.</v>

1138
00:54:06.120 --> 00:54:07.620
We do, and that's a great question

1139
00:54:07.620 --> 00:54:10.260
and I appreciate whoever asked it.

1140
00:54:10.260 --> 00:54:14.340
We have a very robust educational outreach program

1141
00:54:14.340 --> 00:54:18.090
where our educators go into Virginia schools

1142
00:54:18.090 --> 00:54:21.810
and everything is designed to teach, use naval history

1143
00:54:21.810 --> 00:54:24.150
to achieve Virginia state learning standards.

1144
00:54:24.150 --> 00:54:26.100
And our fourth grade, I think it's fourth

1145
00:54:26.100 --> 00:54:29.490
to sixth grade program, is on the Battle of Hampton Roads.

1146
00:54:29.490 --> 00:54:32.280
And we have a big floor map.

1147
00:54:32.280 --> 00:54:35.550
Kids take part in the battle, somebody's Cumberland,

1148
00:54:35.550 --> 00:54:37.650
somebody's Congress, somebody's Virginia,

1149
00:54:37.650 --> 00:54:39.630
and we use the primary source documents.

1150
00:54:39.630 --> 00:54:41.370
So they're very well aware.

1151
00:54:41.370 --> 00:54:43.650
We even have pieces of the Cumberland

1152
00:54:43.650 --> 00:54:46.860
that are not in our permanent artifact collection,

1153
00:54:46.860 --> 00:54:49.290
which we bring into the schools.

1154
00:54:49.290 --> 00:54:50.550
<v ->That's awesome.</v>

1155
00:54:50.550 --> 00:54:51.600
Well, all right, well, I think

1156
00:54:51.600 --> 00:54:54.540
we are about out of time for questions.

1157
00:54:54.540 --> 00:54:57.570
So if you haven't downloaded John's bio in the chat box,

1158
00:54:57.570 --> 00:54:59.160
you might want to do so now.

1159
00:54:59.160 --> 00:55:02.070
And in that box you'll also find more information about John

1160
00:55:02.070 --> 00:55:04.203
and links that may be of interest to you.

1161
00:55:07.650 --> 00:55:10.230
<v ->And if you thought of another question you would like</v>

1162
00:55:10.230 --> 00:55:13.830
to ask John, you can always send them

1163
00:55:13.830 --> 00:55:17.130
to him at the email address listed on this slide.

1164
00:55:17.130 --> 00:55:21.000
You can also learn more about Marilyn's, sorry,

1165
00:55:21.000 --> 00:55:25.473
about the Naval Museum at the URL linked above.

1166
00:55:27.780 --> 00:55:30.090
<v ->And a video recording of this presentation will be</v>

1167
00:55:30.090 --> 00:55:32.850
available on the Sanctuary'S webinar archives page found at

1168
00:55:32.850 --> 00:55:34.530
the URL listed at the top.

1169
00:55:34.530 --> 00:55:36.990
And don't worry, that's a long URL,

1170
00:55:36.990 --> 00:55:39.480
but I will send it to you in an email.

1171
00:55:39.480 --> 00:55:42.540
And in addition, the webinar will be also archived on

1172
00:55:42.540 --> 00:55:45.510
Monitor National Marine Sanctuary's website.

1173
00:55:45.510 --> 00:55:48.120
You'll just click on the multimedia section in the toolbar

1174
00:55:48.120 --> 00:55:49.410
to access the webinar box.

1175
00:55:49.410 --> 00:55:52.980
It usually takes us about 10 days to get this posted,

1176
00:55:52.980 --> 00:55:56.040
but you will eventually get an email that'll tell you

1177
00:55:56.040 --> 00:55:57.690
that the recording is available.

1178
00:55:57.690 --> 00:56:00.330
You'll also find future webinars in that same section.

1179
00:56:00.330 --> 00:56:02.370
And don't worry all of this information

1180
00:56:02.370 --> 00:56:04.620
as I said's gonna be sent to you in an email.

1181
00:56:05.520 --> 00:56:07.980
And our next Submerged North Carolina webinar

1182
00:56:07.980 --> 00:56:09.570
will be on April the 23rd.

1183
00:56:09.570 --> 00:56:12.840
So join underwater archeologist Emily Schwabel

1184
00:56:12.840 --> 00:56:15.570
as she presents research on the submerged archeology

1185
00:56:15.570 --> 00:56:19.230
of rice plantations in Brunswick County, North Carolina.

1186
00:56:19.230 --> 00:56:20.490
Discover how during the 18th

1187
00:56:20.490 --> 00:56:23.700
and 19th century, the Cape Fear region was the only place in

1188
00:56:23.700 --> 00:56:25.890
North Carolina that had the environment

1189
00:56:25.890 --> 00:56:28.350
for commercial rice agricultural

1190
00:56:28.350 --> 00:56:31.170
and learn how rice plantations were operated

1191
00:56:31.170 --> 00:56:34.230
by enslaved Africans who also used the local creeks

1192
00:56:34.230 --> 00:56:38.340
and rivers to travel and in some cases escape enslavement.

1193
00:56:38.340 --> 00:56:39.753
You won't want to miss it.

1194
00:56:42.360 --> 00:56:43.710
<v ->And for the next Office</v>

1195
00:56:43.710 --> 00:56:48.377
of National Marine Sanctuary webinar on March 19th joins

1196
00:56:49.470 --> 00:56:53.130
how she monitors seagrass wasting disease in the field.

1197
00:56:53.130 --> 00:56:54.693
Spoiler alert, it's muddy.

1198
00:56:55.620 --> 00:56:57.720
Methods for analyzing the effects

1199
00:56:57.720 --> 00:56:59.730
of the disease and how in her opinion,

1200
00:56:59.730 --> 00:57:04.080
growing a marine pathogen in the lab can be much harder

1201
00:57:04.080 --> 00:57:05.853
than taking care of a houseplant.

1202
00:57:09.150 --> 00:57:11.790
And of course, we invite you to follow us on social media

1203
00:57:11.790 --> 00:57:14.460
to stay in touch on what's happening in the Sanctuary

1204
00:57:14.460 --> 00:57:18.063
and for future updates on webinars.

1205
00:57:20.640 --> 00:57:23.460
<v ->Lastly, as you exit the webinar, there is a short survey</v>

1206
00:57:23.460 --> 00:57:25.440
for formal and informal educators.

1207
00:57:25.440 --> 00:57:26.610
If you are an educator,

1208
00:57:26.610 --> 00:57:28.800
NOOA would really appreciate it if you just take a couple

1209
00:57:28.800 --> 00:57:31.350
of minutes to complete the survey.

1210
00:57:31.350 --> 00:57:32.970
Your answers will help NOOA develop

1211
00:57:32.970 --> 00:57:34.890
future webinars to meet your needs.

1212
00:57:34.890 --> 00:57:36.570
Your participation is voluntary

1213
00:57:36.570 --> 00:57:39.123
and your answers will be completely anonymous.

1214
00:57:40.740 --> 00:57:43.050
So once again, we want to thank you John,

1215
00:57:43.050 --> 00:57:44.580
for that fabulous presentation.

1216
00:57:44.580 --> 00:57:46.770
And thank you to everyone for taking the time

1217
00:57:46.770 --> 00:57:47.970
to join us today.

1218
00:57:47.970 --> 00:57:49.770
Have a wonderful day, and this concludes

1219
00:57:49.770 --> 00:57:51.303
the presentation for all.